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IAI Liberty Armory 5.7 Johnson

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Blue heeler View Drop Down
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    Posted: Dec 19 2021 at 6:00pm
hi all, just purchased a mint IAI 5.7 Johnson carbine with the Liberty Armory marking. I read that Larry Horner assembled these after IAI went bust. It really is in perfect shape and maybe unfired. I am an experienced hand loader and I am amassing the dies etc. To get her going. Any additional advice or information about this gun is appreciated.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote arthur Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 19 2021 at 11:09pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote adam lee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 16 2022 at 3:46pm
I really like the idea of the 5.7mm/.22 Carbine as an optional barrel swap for any Carbine. Reminds me of the "reverse" swap that I do with my M4/AR-15 platform carbine, which has a second upper in .300 BLK. By reverse, I meant going from a big/slow .30 to a small/fast .22 bullet - as opposed to the other way around for an AR-15 going to .300 BLK. 

Good luck to you with the 5.7 reloading! I'd be interested in following a thread on that subject.

Adam
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote floydthecat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 16 2022 at 4:35pm
When you become invested in reloading for the 7.62x33, you will discover that you can make a better round than the standard 110-grain loading. Of course I think the round is very good for what it does and was meant to do, but it can be improved. It will never be a 5.7 Johnson, but ballistics can be improved. 2500fps and 1300 foot-pounds of energy is not slouchy. Looking for alternative loadings and calibers is an ever-going subject of discussion. I’ve done a bit of it myself.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Blue heeler Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 16 2022 at 5:49pm
So I have loaded some test rounds with 40gr sierra hornet bullets and 40gr hornady xtps, using 12.5 grains of 4227. Unfortunately the weather hasn't been cooperative as far as getting to the range. I'm using redding forming and loading dies.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sleeplessnashadow Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 25 2022 at 10:49am
Blue heeler,

A couple years ago I was in contact with Larry Horner's son. He indicated he was going to share info and pics of his dad's work and Liberty Armory. He never followed thru with anything. I left the Liberty Armory name in the list of manufacturers on the commercial carbine website with the "coming soon" in hopes of encouraging him should he change his mind.

I only have pics of two of the Liberty Armory carbines and a not overall or detailed pics. But the only differences between them and the IAI/iai carbines are the markings and the finish.







Any chance you wouldn't mind sharing pics of yours?

Thanks much

Jim

Edited by sleeplessnashadow - Feb 25 2022 at 11:12am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Blue heeler Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 25 2022 at 12:42pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Blue heeler Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 25 2022 at 12:45pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sleeplessnashadow Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 26 2022 at 8:33pm
Thanks much, Blue heeler.

Are there any markings on top of the receiver behind the rear sight?

I've been collecting serial numbers of the various commercial carbines I've seen over time. Larry Horner at Liberty Armory created a few custom s/n's for people he knew and EX prefix s/n's for his experiments. But most of the carbines with the Liberty Armory markings have had the M888-R prefix s/n's used by iai. Without the iai markings.

Those for the 22 ML model in 5.7mm Johnson that I have seen so far have been in two groups: R207665-R207804 and R211470-R211599. Some have the iai name, a few have the Liberty Armory name. None have had the earlier IAI markings or s/n's.

When the owners changed their company name from Israel Arms International to iai American Legends in January 2002 they stopped using the IAI marking (s/n's up to R206663). All thereafter have the iai marking (lowest I have is R206782). The few iai carbines I have info on when they were sold retail have all been after January 2002.

When iai closed, a bunch of their receivers and parts were left with several different contractors. Including Time Precision in CT and Larry Horner in TX. Both used some of the receivers and parts to build carbines they sold.

Time Precision sold off their iai/IAI surplus to Classic Carbines, who also used them to build carbines. Those sold by Time Precision and Classic Carbines retained their iai/IAI markings and s/n's.

As far as I know, the carbines sold by Larry Horner have all had the Liberty Armory name. There were dozens of parts and receivers left over when Horner died in 2005. They included receivers with markings and s/n's of the various company names used by the people at iai over time. These were sold to an outfit in Houston who has since sold them to another company. Some have ended up in the collection of Larry Ruth, author of the War Baby series on the carbines.

Larry Horner was a member of The Carbine Club. He was well known and respected by many other members. He knew what he was doing with the carbines he built. He was before my time. Something happened the final year iai was in business that produced a bunch of iai carbines with various issues. I think Horner was no longer doing it for them.

Jim

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Blue heeler Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 27 2022 at 8:39am
Rear reciever is marked -

HOU TX
USA
iai

Let me know if you any other info.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sleeplessnashadow Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 27 2022 at 9:24am
Thanks much for the pics and the info. Now I just need to find time to put together the rest of the Liberty Armory page. Been tied up on the infrared scope pages. But, I'll get to it in the not to distant future.

Thanks again

Jim
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sleeplessnashadow Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 12 2022 at 9:10am
Johnson Arms web page is now online for those interested in the 5.7mm Johnson cartridge and carbines that shoot them.

http://www.m1carbinesinc.com/carbine_Johnson.html
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