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Rebel92 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rebel92 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 07 2022 at 8:34pm
Originally posted by 35 Whelen 35 Whelen wrote:

Originally posted by Rebel92 Rebel92 wrote:

I have purchased all of these. Thanks. I went ahead and reloaded the ones that fell under the max trim length of 1.29. So far so good. 

And 35 Wheelen, have you used the Bayou bullets with any other powders, if so, how were the results. I have a somewhat good source for 296 and H110

  Having already established AL2400 and AL410 as my cast bullet powders in my carbines, I have not tried the Bayou bullet with any other powders. I have however used H110 and W296 with my own cast, gas-checked bullets and they worked fine. I'd suggest keeping velocities not much over 1900 fps, which would probably require about 14.0 grs. of either of these powders.

I can’t tell in your picture, but do you have the “coke bottle effect” on your reloads? From the pics it don’t look like it and mine do..
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35 Whelen View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 35 Whelen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 07 2022 at 9:47pm
Originally posted by Rebel92 Rebel92 wrote:

okay thanks smoke. I had bought the stuff expecting all my milsurp to have crimped primer pockets, but never ran into one. All my ammo is either lake city/Korean with a few commercial mixed in. 

 I just finished sizing 200 pieces of LC once fired brass, no primer crimps to be found.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JohnnyDollar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 08 2022 at 10:28am
Originally posted by Rebel92 Rebel92 wrote:

Originally posted by 35 Whelen 35 Whelen wrote:

Originally posted by Rebel92 Rebel92 wrote:

I have purchased all of these. Thanks. I went ahead and reloaded the ones that fell under the max trim length of 1.29. So far so good. 

And 35 Wheelen, have you used the Bayou bullets with any other powders, if so, how were the results. I have a somewhat good source for 296 and H110

  Having already established AL2400 and AL410 as my cast bullet powders in my carbines, I have not tried the Bayou bullet with any other powders. I have however used H110 and W296 with my own cast, gas-checked bullets and they worked fine. I'd suggest keeping velocities not much over 1900 fps, which would probably require about 14.0 grs. of either of these powders.

I can’t tell in your picture, but do you have the “coke bottle effect” on your reloads? From the pics it don’t look like it and mine do..
I know you directed this question to someone else, but.....
 
I believe the "coke bottle" effect you refer too may be the result of full length resizing with a carbide die. 
You may need to back-off your resizing die a bit from the shell holder. You do not want the shell holder to contact the resizing die. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rebel92 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 12 2022 at 5:10pm
Johnny, thanks for the input, but that is in direct contrast from what else I have seen online and in my instructions regarding the full-length carbide sizer touching the shell-holder. can you explain this further??
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 35 Whelen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 12 2022 at 7:48pm
Originally posted by Rebel92 Rebel92 wrote:

Johnny, thanks for the input, but that is in direct contrast from what else I have seen online and in my instructions regarding the full-length carbide sizer touching the shell-holder. can you explain this further??

 You are correct in that the bottom of the sizing die should contact the shellholder. This will result in full-length sizing, which is important when loading for semi-autos. 

 I bought an RCBS .30 Carbine carbide die and tried sizing with it without lube. This resulted in the coke bottle effect on cases. Lubing the cases solved that problem, but I figure if lube is required, then a carbide die is pretty much pointless. So I'm now using a regular sizing die. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Smokpole Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 12 2022 at 7:49pm
The coke bottle effect is caused by excessive sizing of the case. The sides are squeezed down further than they need to be and the base is not. Standard dies are shaped internally to the case being sized. Carbide dies use a single diameter carbide ring at the mouth of the die and are not shaped to the form of the cartridge being sized. This is why the coke bottle shape is common in carbide die resized cases but not often found in standard dies. The shape is accentuated when the case mouth is expanded for bullet seating as well. This leaves the case with a "waist". Carbide rifle dies for bottleneck cases use the carbide ring only for neck sizing so don't result in a "coke bottle' case.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote floydthecat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 13 2022 at 6:03am
Can we safely say it’s just a cosmetic issue? I would rather see a bit of bottlenecking knowing the mouth is properly sized to hold the projectile as opposed to a perfect looking case that might not provide proper tension. I have had worn dies that would not size the mouth to a point that would hold a bullet. The bullet is not going to expand the mouth any further than it needs to be. I can’t even guess how many rounds of any straight-wall or carbine reloads I have fired that exhibited a slight deformity at the mouth. If they chamber and shoot, short of maybe overworking the brass a bit, it’s just a cosmetic issue to me.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JohnnyDollar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 13 2022 at 6:29am
Originally posted by Rebel92 Rebel92 wrote:

Johnny, thanks for the input, but that is in direct contrast from what else I have seen online and in my instructions regarding the full-length carbide sizer touching the shell-holder. can you explain this further??

This is one source of my information, 

I thought you meant a bulge at the bottom of the case after sizing.


https://www.sierrabullets.com/reload-basics/resizing-depriming/


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Carbide Sizers


Carbide sizing dies have become tremendously popular in the past ten to fifteen years, and for good reason. As we have already seen, carbide dies do away with the necessity of lubricating cases prior to the resizing process. They do require some attention to how they are set up, to avoid damage to the die, and obtain best results. The often repeated advice to screw the die body down until it contacts the shell holder, will give poor results with a carbide die and may even result in cracking the carbide insert. NEVER adjust the die body down so far that it will contact the shell holder. Carbide dies for straight-wall cases are not designed to full-length resize, and are frequently adjusted to give what amounts to excessive resizing. This often results in an undesirable bulge slightly above the extractor groove. Often called the “Coke bottle” effect, this will cause the brass to be worked excessively and can lead to reduced case life. The only portion of the case that needs to be resized is the area that is expanded by firing. For use in revolvers especially, the case need only be sized enough to allow the case to chamber freely again. Often, this may involve sizing only half the length of the case body and is in effect, neck sizing. If this is enough to allow the case to be chambered easily, then the die is adjusted down far enough.


This will avoid overworking the brass, and will eliminate the so-called Coke-bottle effect.


However Smokpole has the most probable answer.




Edited by JohnnyDollar - Jan 13 2022 at 6:57am
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Rebel92 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rebel92 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 13 2022 at 8:49am
thanks. Is the coke bottle just a cosmetic thing. Not a safety or function issue?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote floydthecat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 13 2022 at 9:01am
Originally posted by Rebel92 Rebel92 wrote:

thanks. Is the coke bottle just a cosmetic thing. Not a safety or function issue?

I think mostly a cosmetic issue. Partial sizing might never be a problem and likely won’t be if one loads for only one gun. However, I suggest that no two chambers can be exactly alike and it might be possible for a round sized only to fit “that” one chamber…might not fit another chamber. Far-fetched….maybe, but full length sizing eliminates that possibility as remote as it might be.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rdftwo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 13 2022 at 4:28pm
Originally posted by floydthecat floydthecat wrote:

I’m your Huckleberry…….and you are my neighbor anyway😁.

Different loaders (the person) might have little tricks they use, so some of this stuff can vary and get rather lengthy. Some folks dress up in a hazmat suit (practically) and were a respirator. People like me sit around in their underwear and do it. 

My suggestion is that you go watch your buddy load a few of his calibers and maybe load some carbine rounds for you as you observe. Another option is to offer to buy me lunch and I might come help you.

I have a good record. Still got 10-fingers, 10-toes, 2-eyes and one nose. Have never blew-up a pet or damaged my wife in the process.



Laughed my a** off, love this guy.  I can't say the same about the wife.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Smokpole Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 13 2022 at 7:40pm
While the coke bottle/wasp waist appearance is not a safety issue, it does work harden the brass after a number of reloads. Your cases won't last quite as long. It really isn't much of an issue as long as you have a good supply of brass. But the less case distortion you have, the longer your brass will last.
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Rebel92 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rebel92 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 13 2022 at 8:10pm
not gonna lie, I have went a little crazy and have bought more 30 carbine ammo in the last 2 years than was made by Lake City (not really, but I did go nuts)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote David Milisock Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 14 2022 at 9:35am
That's not nuts, that's practical.  What I will say is from buying and chronagraphing new factory stuff is that it's in many brands clocking at 2,000+ FPS with 110 grain projectiles at 10 feet from the muzzle.

That's anywhere from 50 to 150 FPS faster than factory and the surplus I got years ago. The lousy ammo that was available was the reason I got into loading for the Carbine. I can safely get 2050 from my two rifles. After reading Hatchers notes on the cartridge in the Carbine I was surprised to see they were measuring at 20 and 50 feet.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 35 Whelen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 14 2022 at 10:18am
Accurate/Western Powders has data for 110 gr. bullets that runs well over 2100 fps. Don't know that they're needed or necessary, but interesting, nevertheless.

 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote David Milisock Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 14 2022 at 10:35am
That makes sense Hatcher was at 2,000+ at 50 feet.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote floydthecat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 14 2022 at 1:49pm
Take a peak at those light projectile loads. I shoot a 85-grain Mauser SP slug that chrono’s over 2400. Hodgdon publishes a 17.5-grain H110 load at around 35,000psi pressure and 2450mv. Completely safe and pushes energy up past 1200.

You can really make a 7.62x33 sing if you have the ability and equipment to play.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote David Milisock Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 14 2022 at 6:12pm
Originally posted by 35 Whelen 35 Whelen wrote:

Accurate/Western Powders has data for 110 gr. bullets that runs well over 2100 fps. Don't know that they're needed or necessary, but interesting, nevertheless.

 
I check the Accurate site, the current data and test barrel for the data is 20" loss in an 18" will be 50 to 100 FPS. Lists 2153 FPS.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rebel92 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Mar 16 2022 at 4:31pm
update:

Reloading has went great. I thought it would be cheaper, but all it has done has increased the amount i shoot LOL Have learned alot from you guys, thanks again. Have loaded up around 1500, shot about half of them. Have learned some things about my carbines (i.e. that some are picky and prefer the COL on the short end of 1.64 and others will digest them up to 1.68). 

I also have my Bayou Bullets coming in tomorrow that I ordered in January that I am eager to try out. Even though they are 115 grain vs 110, still load 14grains of 110 or 296? I think 35whelen said something to that effect. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Sawbones Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Mar 16 2022 at 5:39pm
I've been reloading for 36 years.  I am new to 30 carbine reloading and am on the learning curve as I write this.
Here are some Pearls to consider.
Case length is more critical than most think.  Consider this: Does it take more energy (pressure) to propel a bullet out of a 1.290" length case than a 1.280" length case?  You bet your boots it does.  That difference affects accuracy.
Reloading ain't fun if your looking at shooting 100 rounds in 1 plink session.  I reload everything in my gun safe save for the rimfire stuff so I treated myself to an RCBS Trim Mate case prep. machine.  (Google Youtube RCBS trim mate and watch the videos)

With that machine properly furnished w/ trimming equipment one can run a de-capped, sized case: 
1) trim to 1.280 using the Lee Case length gauge (Google it up),
2) clean the primer pocket by using the RCBS small pocket reamer (which reams to a finite depth then only cleans the crud outa the pocket afterward)
3) chamfer the mouth of the casing
 all in <8-10 seconds per case!

Give it a try.  I told my guru reload friend about mine and he scoffed and laughed, "Smith you and your stoopid ideas"
I bought him one, delivered , set it up and demonstrated it.  "It's all yours idiot, for the welding job you did on my stealth hunting golf cart." He tried it out and you'd think I had just handed him a sack of cut diamonds.   "Hey, this works!" I convinced him.
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